New comments on 'Crappy Eggs......'

New comment from chelsharmony

Mon, 18 Aug 2008 13:30:23 -0500

so wiht the clomid challenge your number should go down if you are ok and it will go up if you are a poor responder MLO?

My RE doesnt consider me a "poor responder" but it sure seemed like that to me. I responded to the meds the same way each time no matter how much i took (pretty much anyway).

chelsharmony

New comment from chelsharmony

Mon, 18 Aug 2008 13:28:07 -0500

im in milwaukee and just found out that the wonderful doc that delivered my 9 pounder son is now an RE in Waukesha and i just loved her so i may go and see her for a 2nd opinion.

I so much appreciate all of the advise from all of you! Its so helpful and yes, it is pretty strange to start thinking about DE's, something i thought i would never have to think about. lol

chelsharmony

New comment from Lisa E

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 22:23:41 -0500

Chels,

I see you are from WI. Me too!!!

Where about in the Cheesehead state?!

I'm not sure what exactly you are looking for in regards to an RE- but I LOVED mine! I didn't have to do see her for anything really involved- just for Clomid and ultrasound monitoring but I ADORE her! I also have a friend here at work that's been TTC for 7 years who has recently started seeing her and so far she likes her!

Lisa E

New comment from Veronica

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 19:46:06 -0500

MLO: sounds great! looking forward to it :)

Everyone: I kindly ask that you share with others on these other blogs/sites about FertilityTies.com, the only comprenhensive online community for TTCers with access to free daily medical advice.

Chelsharmony: Sorry to hijack your post, but it's all very relevant, and I'm glad you're getting great advice and truly hope you'll be able to find an RE who is going to help you achieve your dreams.

Veronica

New comment from MLO

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 19:38:31 -0500

Fly.

The board that has basically become home for most high FSHers is here:

http://www.network54.com/Forum/209394/ - known as The New High FSH Board

There are a couple of others linked to from there as well - Pregnant Despite High FSH, Over 40 with High FSH, etc.

There are some things that poor responders face that others don't. And, if you are very unlucky, you get the High FSH diagnosis from some doctors with "the DE speech" - a searchable term, btw. Basically, because High FSH patients (and poor responders) are such a threat to a clinics statistics - at least under the old system - many will not even consider cycling you with your own eggs. It is absolutely vital that your RE be "High FSH Friendly" (shortcut term) because we are a different patient population than a lot of doctors are used to working with.

Some physicians can come across rather blase about how easy a transition it is to move from using one's own gametes vs. someone else's. I know a number of women who have done donor egg and that was the right choice for them, but it can be a totally devastating shock for someone to process. The average new poster on the High FSH boards starts with someone being at the absolute end of their rope emotionally after getting "the DE speech."

There are also a couple of poor responder boards at www.ivfconnections.com - which is also the home of a very snarky IVF Veterans board. This is not a board for the faint of heart.

There is also a wonderful little Primary Infertility Board at www.fertilethoughts.com.

Each of these places serves a slightly different need.

I also follow a number of blogs. The most popular blog around has to be http://stirrup-queens.blogspot.com/ . I have a private blog where I let my fully lupron-induced self reign free. (That is password protected or everyone's safety ;-) )

Veronica - I will send you a private message about a non-infertility site you may be interested in from a technological point of view.

MLO

New comment from Lisa E

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 18:49:52 -0500

WOW! MLO- you fly or drive from Michigan to California to see Dr. Q?

Lisa E

New comment from Veronica

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 18:45:53 -0500

yes, I'd be interested as well, to see how those boards work and see if it's something we can offer in FertilityTies.com as well.

Thanks MLO! all your insight is great!

Veronica

New comment from tami

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 18:42:41 -0500

MLO--where do I go to find the high FSH & poor responder boards that you speak of. My 3 day FSH on the clomid challenge test was 13. After taking clomid for the 5 days it was 5. I would be interested in hearing/reading about the board.

tami

New comment from MLO

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 18:30:03 -0500

Again, be careful, there are drugs and some autoimmune disorders that can be associated with odd clomid results. (Again, the High FSH and Poor Responder boards are filled with these stories, as well.) Some clinics don't even use it - except to figure out initial dosages for the injectibles.

Since you are in WI, you may have to travel. The best clinicians for working with poor responders and "hard" cases are on the East and West Coasts. I'm in Michigan and I am seeing Dr. Q. It is worth all the hassle to work with someone who isn't going to dismiss your desire to try with your own eggs - but also gives you a realistic estimation of your chances.

Good Luck!

MLO

New comment from MLO

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 18:20:06 -0500

PITA = Pain In The A#@

MLO

New comment from tonya

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 16:30:45 -0500

also 8 being close to 10 is not the way to view it .in medical terms 8 is pretty far away from 10

tonya

New comment from tonya

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 16:29:40 -0500

chelsha mine day 3 fsh was 7.3 and still my doc gave me the challenge test .because 40%of women who hav normal day 3 fsh will hav elevated day 10 fsh.

tonya

New comment from chelsharmony

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 16:27:08 -0500

my day 3 was 8 and that is pretty close to 10 as far as im concerned! Uggg...... the doc was like "naw, its fine" but Kan's was 3 so im pretty concerned about that.

We did do ISCY each time with the IVF caryn.

Thanks for all the info ladies! I will deff get moving in the right direction now :)

chelsharmony

New comment from Caryn

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 15:27:24 -0500

Chels-

Clomid Challenge Test (CCCT)

Women are born with their lifetime supply of eggs within the ovaries. Each month follicles, each of which contains one egg, are recruited under the influence of follicle stimulating hormone. One follicle will become dominant, develop to maturity, and be ovulated. Ovarian reserve is a measure of the "quality" of the eggs remaining within the ovaries. Ovarian reserve naturally declines as a woman ages and approaches the menopause.

However, diminished reserve can occur in younger women due to perimenopause, genetics, or for unknown reasons. In the standard infertility evaluation, levels of the hormones FSH, LH, and estradiol are measured on day 3. An elevated FSH level on day 3 is one indication of poor ovarian reserve or that the menopause is approaching.

If your FSH on day 3 was normal, then there is no reason for this? Correct?

Chels- has your FSH on day 3 been normal?

Many infertility treatment centers do not offer IVF to women who have a poor clomiphene citrate challenge test result. IVF using donor eggs or adoption are usually the best options for these couples.

Caryn

New comment from Maele

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 15:21:28 -0500

I'm 35, tick tock tick tock... Good luck with the clomid, keep us posted.

Do you think I have a chance if I bd'd the day before and the day after pos opk (day after shows temp rise already) but not the day of? I'm disappointed we didn't get to that day cuz I just had the HSG done and I had such high hopes for this cycle.

Maele

New comment from tonya

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 15:15:36 -0500

im very glad to read that ur switching clinics!

tonya

New comment from tonya

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 15:12:22 -0500

clomid challenge test is not to find out ur ovulating or not.its a little more specific than day 3 fsh.they give u clomid for the usual days then measure ur fsh on day 10.many times with day 3 fsh women will hav normal value ,but day 10 fsh after clomid challenge test is more accurate coz it picks out those women who apparently hav a normal day 3 fsh.this will just help you chelsea in knowing if u REALLY do hav egg issues or not.also chels what was your antral follicle count on day 3 ultrasound,i wud definately ask ur doc about that .yes chels my frozen was succsessful so thanks.

tonya

New comment from Caryn

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 14:49:21 -0500

Hi Chels- Thats why I switched RE's.. I was like, "You have the Med degree, why am I asking all the Q's and telling you what to do!" This RE (my new one) I feel good about.. even though my lining was thin last month.. I still felt good, she realyl makes you feel like your the only patient and calls you, not just the nurses...

I do not think you need the :Clomid challenge" since you O on your own...

Good Luck with DH on the Urologist.. my DH see's one..

Have you ever trid ICSI ??

Caryn

New comment from chelsharmony

Fri, 15 Aug 2008 14:46:30 -0500

im in wisconsin and i am gonna go to another clinic - as convenient as this one is and i truley do like the RE and everyone there but something just isnt right. I shouldnt be asking all these ?'s, they should be telling me this stuff.

Maele - im so sorry for your situation - its rough, really rough.

When i went to talk to my OB instead of RE he wasnt comfy with Femera and wanted me to try the Clomid, if it didnt work in 3 times he would consider femera.

How old are you maele? Im 33 and will be 34 in september, time is a ticken!!! LOL!

Tonya - i think i read that you are now in the 1st trimester, congrats!

What is a "clomid challenge"? I ovulate on my own each month and he just gave me 50mg to take from days 3-7 and then call the next month if not preggo.

My DH is going to a urologist on the 18th (took a month to get in) and my RE never even said for him to go, i found the doc myself and made the appt. His morph was at 1% with his SA and he was like - "well, with IUI and IVF it isnt a problem".

Thanks for the great info MLO - i love the thing you said about diggin up the docs thesis! How awesome are you?!?!?! LOL, good stuff. Whats a PITA?

chelsharmony

New comment from MLO

Tue, 12 Aug 2008 21:20:45 -0500

In a very small percentage of women FSH is not an accurate indication of ovarian reserve - or those who will respond poorly. That's why a lot of clinics are moving towards Antral Follicle Count as a better predictor.

Also, you can get crappy eggs in any cycle. No two cycles are the same. Occasionally, a woman will get pregnant with "bad" eggs only to miscarry. The High FSH and Poor Responder boards are filled with such stories.

Having said that, find someone like Dr. Q who has experience working with poor responders. We are a little different than other patients and a lot of clinics are not able to step outside of their normal patient box and work properly with us. Do a search on the phrase "high fsh friendly REs" and you will be able to see who has been successful treating women with supposedly "crappy" eggs. (Somtimes REs will blame "crappy" eggs when there are other issues.)

Again, when you run into being a poor responder / accused of having crappy eggs/embryos, often, it is best to travel to an RE who is known to be able to help poor responders. BTW: Always get a copy of your medical records so you can quickly review REs. Most women who run into your issues will "interview" several of the REs who do work with poor responders / those with crappy eggs and go with the one they "click" with. (Not every doctor is right for every patient. Many doctors could never put up with DH and I because, well, we look up EVERYTHING in Medline and other sources. I've been known to dig up someone's doctoral thesis. Yeah, I'm a PITA. At least I know enough to do a citation analysis before bringing something up.)

chels, where are you located?

MLO

Crappy Eggs......

Tue, 12 Aug 2008 10:02:05 -0500

So I tlaked with the RE this past weekend and all my tests came out fine, including the chromosomal testing - YEAH! Right? Well, kinda. That is good but means nothing to “fix” to help get us preggo.

I asked him to talk to the embryologist to see what was up and if there was something wrong with the eggs b4 the fertilization or just after. Turns out that I have crappy eggs. He hated to say it since I am 33 and they don’t see that “too often” is what he said. We have gotten preggo on our own but lost it early and then lost another 2 (we think) thry IVF.

My questions are:

1. Can you do anything to help “fix” the crummy eggs? I already take a pre-natal vitamin, a Vit E pill, Omega 3 pill, calcium/magnesium/zinc vitamin.

2. Can this have messed up my eggs - I don’t eat very well now or ever, have been anorexic as well as bulimic.

3. Do you know what it costs to get some donor eggs? Do you buy them by the number and then freeze them if you don’t use them all?

Thx a bunch!

chelsharmony